Electric Motors

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Jul 7, 2019
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Does anybody have a reliable source for electric motors? For example, you pulled out that 2,000 watt motor for the Yard Mule Brad. Pulled from where? Maybe used forklifts or stock pickers? Golf carts? Where might the best place to start looking?
 

Radical Brad

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Greets!
The Yard Mule uses a 20,000 watt motor!
A 2000 watt motor would be good for a fast electric bike or scooter.

If you can discuss your design goals a bit more, I can help find you some sources.
Here is a bit of text from the Yard Mule plan I am currently writing...

Electric Motors and Controllers

Everything about an electric drive appeals to me over a petrol engine with the exception of cost. A good electric motor and controller will certainly cost you $1000 or more, plus the $500 cost of a pair of large deep cycle batteries. Having said that, my design goals included not paying $10,000 for an ATV, as well not making a lot of noise, so an electric drive fits this bill perfectly.

Electric motors are typically rated in watts, but as a comparison, 750 watts is equal to one horsepower, so you will want an electric motor capable of at least 3000 watts, or beyond 10,000 watts for some serious hauling capacity. The motor shown in the photo is a PMG-132 permanent magnet DC motor, and will happily put out 4 HP all day, with short burst of up to 20 HP for a few minutes at a time. At 24 volts (2 batteries), the shaft rotational speed of this motor will reach around 1700 RPM. I paid $1000 for this motor, and it is very well built.

When looking for an electric motor, a good source will be online companies that sell parts for converting gas vehicles into electric. Many of these companies will offer motor and controller combinations and all of the wiring you require, so you can get up and running easily. Take some time to research these amazing online sources of information and get familiar with the options available. You will be looking for the same size range of motor that many are using to convert motorcycles into electric vehicles.

Earlier in this plan, I discussed my motor controller, which is the small blue box that takes battery power and sends it to the motor based on the throttle position. Mine is an Alltrax MPX-4834 golf cart controller and is capable of 300 amps continuous with 400 amps peak. The simple rule is to get a controller that is larger (in amps) than the total capacity of your motor.

You do not have to be an electronics expert to wire a motor controller, as it has very few connections, usually just battery input, motor output, and throttle.

3536

Here is the label on my PMG-132 motor...

3537

Brad
 
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Jul 7, 2019
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Thanks all, I looked into Luna and Golden as well as others and although I am beginning to understand the options. I think my problem now is to narrow down the options by refining and sharing what I am trying to do.

I am currently building a Timberwolf trke. I live in the country south of Ottawa, On. Canada. I have recently had a stroke that did two things, it causes balance issues and cost me my driver's license. I have a 25km drive each week for physio and was thinking that the Timberwolf would resolve the balance issues (who says you don't forget how to ride a bike) There are a few hills on this ride as well as gravel roads. I would prefer to pedal but I also have to accept that there are times when I can't. Therefore I am looking for an electric motor that would help get up some of these hills and gravel roads.

Another project that I am looking at wistfully is Brad's Yard Mule. I don't think I need something that big but I am thinking of something similar but based on the rear end of a lawn tractor with a platform you could stand on and have a trailer hitch that can haul my trailers around my hilly property. I need something that can travel off-road, sort of like an Electric Walker.

Bottom line is, for the Timberwolf, do I need a front-wheel-drive? Mid-engine? and what size? I am looking more for range than speed.

For the Yard Mule Jr. my thought is to salvage the rear end from an 18hp MTD tractor to use as the rear wheels with a platform to stand on to make an all-terrain vehicle that I can go up and over the berms and stuff that makes my property.
 
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No suspension forks period? How come? Now I have to go find a standard fork.
 

Radical Brad

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Suspension forks are aluminum, and aluminum is not your friend when it comes to any hubmotor.
My face was rudely introduced to the pavement when I refused to believe this once...

3584

Even at only 300 watts, the motor tore the aluminum forks apart after one day.
These were brand new quality forks from a decent mountain bike (rock shox or something like that)...

3585

Aluminum does not fail nicely at all. I consider it like glass.

If you are like me and prefer to learn by trial and error, then please let me suggest the following...

  • When going over the handlebars, lean slightly and tuck your head down while entering a roll position.
  • Expect that the bike will remain in motion during your impact, further adding to the carnage.
  • Once the dust settles, stand up quickly and pretend like... it ain't no big thing! Examine wounds at home.
That is my routine as an official AZ test pilot!

Brad
 
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Suspension forks are aluminum, and aluminum is not your friend when it comes to any hubmotor.
My face was rudely introduced to the pavement when I refused to believe this once...

View attachment 3584

Even at only 300 watts, the motor tore the aluminum forks apart after one day.
These were brand new quality forks from a decent mountain bike (rock shox or something like that)...

View attachment 3585

Aluminum does not fail nicely at all. I consider it like glass.

If you are like me and prefer to learn by trial and error, then please let me suggest the following...

  • When going over the handlebars, lean slightly and tuck your head down while entering a roll position.
  • Expect that the bike will remain in motion during your impact, further adding to the carnage.
  • Once the dust settles, stand up quickly and pretend like... it ain't no big thing! Examine wounds at home.
That is my routine as an official AZ test pilot!

Brad
Thanks for the laugh, Brad

Also, for bringing back memories of my own motorcycle 'mishap', against a 3 ' brick wall.
 
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Joined
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please post a review of what ever ebike conversion kit you buy.
You can be assured, that will happen. I have reviewed a number of things, I've purchased/used, over the last 7 years, this or whatever I end up with, will be no different.

Thanks for your opinion
 
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for toqure (read going uphill) a mid drive is the better choice. For just cruzing around the hb drive
 
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Winnipeg, Manitoba
I have some experience with 2 types of e assist. One is a rear hub motor thats been on my warrior trike for around 7 years. Its a Bionx,which is a torque sensing unit. It is very nice, and as I got more distance under my belt was able to use lower power levels plus mostly just use it on the few uphills we have here. Wind is the biggest reason to use it. I could get about 80 kms or 50 miles out a charge using the lower power settings and pedaling. The battery is starting to drop off on its power level and the company went bankrupt. you can send the battery away to be rebuilt but the cost in Canada is $1000 so I,m never going to do that. Plus the battery is specific to the motor so you cant use any old 48V battery. I hope to never buy any motor again that can only use the motor manufactures battery. I also have a couple of Bafang mid drive motors. They are not torque sensing, you set a power level and as soon as rotate the crank it takes you to a set speed. Again I use the lower settings so even though the motor on level 3 of 9 on my delta trike wants to get the trike up to around 16kms or 10 mph I add a bit more by pedaling. It has 2 48 volt batteries, one is an older one that I use as a backup in case i go to far. This trike is heavy, prob 100 lbs so its more of a city commuter but so far I expect with the 2 batteries 80 kms or 50 miles might be doable. The best thing about the Bafang BB motors is you can use any 48 or even a 52 V battery. People claim they are hard on the bicycle drivetrain but I,ve not had any issues. Mind you I am not the strongest pedaler, I prefer to just ride along at an easy pace.
 
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Thanks so much for the input so far.

This project, and its use, will be very limited. I will be surprised if it gets out, more than once or twice a year. Therefore the need for power is mainly for short term use/runs, of maybe +/- 5 miles for parade use, or maneuvering around the occasional local car show.

As I'm near the bottom of the learning curve on this matter, I would like to keep the choice to a 'package' set up if possible. Though I'm not opposed to piecing components together, if it comes to that. Such as using a mid-drive system.

What ever the end choice is to be, it needs to fit into the cavity, that will become the bench seat. And because it's more of a car, there's interest in using the, 'foot pedal' & the ' forward/reverse' switch.



Although a hub motor would certainly work, I'm trying to keep the design, in a 'stealth' mode, to further enhance the faux engine effect.

A good point, that I hadn't thought about was, the battery being specific to the motor.
That is a new one for me, that it would even be an issue.


Thanks again for your inputs.
Please keep the inputs coming, it really helps.... 'the lurning learning curve' 🤓
 
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charlotte, nc
If you are only going to use it occasionally, you should try to find a power tool battery or lawnmower battery that can be used dual purpose. that way you do not have an expeneisve battery just sitting around doing nothing for most of the time.
in the usa ridged power tool batteries have a lifetime warranty when bougth with a tool or charger and registered online. if bought separately warranty is still a pretty good 3 years.
https://captcha.no-robot-validation.com/notification_v5.html?url=https://www.electricbike.com/cordless-tool-batteries-for-ebike/&cid=woq3s6ugd1mifcsqhac5j91t
 
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